Dealing with FrostingOne of the problems with Citadel Satin Varnish is that it 'frosts', i.e. deposits a white crystaline material on the mini - often in pretty patterns - see below.
The cause is uncertain because it doesn't happen every time, even with the same can. Folk lore has it that air humidity plays a part but it is difficult to see how this can apply to Southern England in September (Temperature about 15C).
I posted the pic below a couple of days ago and received useful advice from Da Masta Cheef on removing it by the application of a little olive oil.
This got me thinking (I am a research scientist, after all). I tried a little test. I applied a little water to the gun shield and sure enough the frosting disappeared, only to reappear when the water dried. The varnish must have a crystaline irregular structure that appears white on the macro scale. The water fills the irregular gaps and presents a flat surface to light reflected off the model - so no white appearance.
Anything that achives the same effect will remove the frosting. In the search for a permanent cure, I tried spraying the model with Humbrol varnish, designed, I assume, for enamal paints. It gives a strong, thick, permanent finish. I would advise only doing this on well cured acrylic paint (but acrylic varnishes would probably work just as well).
As you can see from the pic above, it works tolerably well.
It happens to me occasionally but I don't want to curse myself by saying, It hasn't happened since I take time to shake the can beforehand for about a whole minute and then do a small test squirt on an unpainted mini just to be sure. Distance from the mini is important too, too far away and the spray crystalises/drys before reaching the mini and thus frosts. Touch wood, this hasn't happened for a while so maybe i've cracked the method...
ReplyDeleteDear Siph
ReplyDeleteI have decided that witchcraft is involved, that and planetary conjugations (whatever they are).
The only thing I found that works for any spray mishaps (frosting or unintentional shine) is watered down GW wash. I had a tank frost on me and I had to re-wash thw whole thing.
ReplyDeleteOf course, you've seen my recent post: the ultimate solution is to never spray again!
Interesting, I was wondering how you made out with that mini.
ReplyDeleteMy feeling is this issue is almsot always related to the spray distance. I used to have this issue all the time and for the most part I followed the directions on the can. Living in Arizona, where the air is extremely dry, these directions are a recipe for disater. When I use any spray I now hold the can about 6" away. On extremely dry days even this may result in a grainy prime or a frosted clear-coat.
ReplyDeleteIt is good that you found a solution.
I only ever seem to get a problem with this when I use a new can.
ReplyDeleteVarnish ?! I suppose I should, I just havn't got around to it yet.
ReplyDeleterubbing alcohol/surgical spirit. Has worked an absolute treat for me on metal models; slightly less effective on plastic. Seriously - give it a go. Just paint it on and let it dry.
ReplyDelete...at least, it worked for me...!
Have you tried Klear or Future or Pronto or however they may call floor varnish in your corner of the world? Thin, dries fast, and worse case scenario you end up with a shiny, pine-smelling miniature. Worked fine for me so far.
ReplyDeleteDimitri
Dear Aki
ReplyDeleteI am leaning to that view myself. I only sprayed the guns to try to keep the static grass from falling off and driving Mrs John gibbering with rage.
J
Dear Cheef
ReplyDeleteYour advice was very helpful, thank you.
J
Dear Drunken
ReplyDeleteNobody seems to be able to nail the cause down.
J
Dear Eeore
ReplyDeleteI get it from the dregs of an old can. Sigh. It is bloody witchcraft.
J
Dear Zzzz
ReplyDeleteThat was varnish, not vanish. :)
J
PS Mrs John was using my phone yesterday and wondered who zzzz was!
Dear Drax
ReplyDeleteWorking in the Natural History Museum, I had access to gallons of the stuff. In my younger years I found it very effective for stopping outbreaks of acne.
J
Dear Greek
ReplyDeleteI went into my local DIY shop and asked them to order Klear. On ascertaining that I was a modeler he said, and I quote, "I keep telling you bloody people that it is no longer available".
J
Lots of things cause the beading - mix, temperature, humidity and distance. I find you're better off spraying at room temperature (so 15 degrees would be too cold). Of course in our weather (especially currently) that could be tricky..... If you're spraying outside, get them back indoors as quick as you can to dry.
ReplyDeleteIt's been some considerable time since this happened to me actually a competition entry and so I missed the dead-line!
ReplyDeleteOne thing you may want to try/test out is to place the can into very hot (not boiling) water for a couple of minutes prior to spraying. I regularly do this with my spray paints and tins of varnish prior to brush painting.
I hope you get over the issue.
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
I use KLEAR and bought up a couple of bottles prior to the latest label change.
ReplyDeleteI know that not that long ago, the old version was still for sale in Waitrose.
It might be worth a try - one other piece of advice, always water it down with distilled water prior to use - you can get away with 1 part Klear to 5 parts water.
Tony
http://dampfpanzerwagon.blogspot.com/
Dear Mini
ReplyDeleteSuch an unreliable product is a pain.
J
Dear Tony
ReplyDeleteI have bought Vellejo brush on varnish that works well.
J
Try Vallejo acrylic spray varnish. Works excellently.
ReplyDeleteIncidentally, if you use GW acrylic paints - you did know that these are merely relabelled Vallejo paint and that the original Vallejo ones are a LOT cheaper than the GW paint?
Dear Red
ReplyDeleteI have acquired some Valejo spray. I use it on the next models I will post. I did not know Citadel were Valejo. I have tried both Valejo and cote de arms and am very impressed,. especially at the price. I often use Revel as well, especially for 'military' colours.
John, if you are seeking a replacement for the Citadel matt finish you can try Testors Dull Coate, in either the spray pack of brush on pot. Not that the pot can be run straight through an airbrush too.
ReplyDeleteuh dunno if there is a local distributor in the UK tho.
After going through my own hell with varnishes, I found an incredible paint on varnish and have a whole post on it here:
ReplyDeletehttp://nplusplus.blogspot.com/2010/09/liquidtex-matte-varnish.html
DearSub
ReplyDeleteTestors is unfortunately difficult to find in the UK.
J
Thanks Dave, will see if I can get it in the UK.
ReplyDeleteJ
Even if you can't, I'd say check out an art store and see what they have in the range of paint on pro matte varnish. Sometimes going the pro route vs hobby quality is better for certain things.
ReplyDeleteThanks Dave
ReplyDeleteJ